What are the differences between second gen and 3rd gen wit CR

[JOHNFAK]

To increase my thread count and to post over here

So the 3rd gen come with a common rail rather than vp44 ..... what else ?

[ISX]

The injectors are computer controlled individually. The transmissions are different. Axle ratios are 3.73 and 4.10 I think, rather than 3.55 and 4.10. Body is different, interior is different.

Engines have all been the same basic block but with different fuel systems. The block might change a little through the years but not much.

What specifically do you want to know? There are many obvious changes but I don't know if you want more details on how common rail works or what.

[JOHNFAK]

No.
Kinda what you said.

I knew the shape/style of body as well as the CR injection (ECM controlled delivery) was different
I figured there may be some emissions stuff depending on year ?

But wasn't sure what else

IS the tranny a 48re for auto ?

Anything else (major ) ?

[Wild and Free]

It is a 48 re tranny. the frames are built stronger and are heavier. They have a bigger/ stronger t-case. they have amarican axles rather than Danas hence the gear ratio difference. No difference in exhaust related emmissions until the 6.7 came along with the dpf system in 07-08.

[Mopar1973Man]

The price of 6 injectors on a 3rd Gen is more than a VP44 pump on a 2nd Gen...

The failure point of the CR engine is from poor filter performance and damages the internal valve of the injector that controls injector firing.

Typically the 3rd gen get just slightly less MPGs because of the multiple injector firings to make them quiet. 6.7L are worse with the DPF re-gen.

[JOHNFAK]

cool

thats interesting on the axles/gears as well as the injector failures

yeah I was on cumminsforum and someone was like $2k for injectors - and I was like

Thought they were higher performance afterarket or something ..... but nope - CCR :P

nice.

[AH64ID]

Some of this will be a repeat.

Axles: AAM (9.25" FR, 10.5" Rear (03-04 some SO's), 11.5" all HO's, and all 04.5+) 3.73, 4.10, 3.42 08+

Man Trans: NV4500 03-04, NV5600 03-05; G56 AD 05.5+, G56 AE 07.5+ (RARE in late 07's)

Auto: Early SO's may have 47RE; rest run 48RE (OEM Exhaust Brake capable in 06); 68RFE 07.5+

Xfer Case: NV271 Manual Shift, NV273 Elec Shift

Turbos: HE341 03-04; HE351CW 04.5-07; HE351VE (VNT) 07.5-curr

Head: 03-04 increased flow from 2nd gen; 04.5-05 better flow and better valve seats; 06+ changes to casting for swirl action of air, and IIRC minor valve seat changes.

Injection; CP3 HPCR, up to 23,207 psi for 5.9, and 26,107 psi for 6.7.

Lift Pump: Engine mounted crap till 05, then a quite reliable in-tank that still being used.

Cab's: Quad Cab is streached to be a 3/4 Crew; Mega Cab is introdued in 06 (QCLB frame with a short box)

Frame: Hydroformed (not sure if 2nd gen were)

Brakes: 4 Wheel discs, large enough 17's must be used.

Suspension: From what I can tell all CTD's have the same front spring rates, and they all have the same FAWR; Rear 2500 and 3500 SRW use the same base 4/1 leaf pack rated at 2600 lbs per pack. 3500 DRW has a 3/1 leaf setup rated at 2800 lbs per pack. Both SRW and DRW 3500's have a 2pack overload setup rated at 1400 lbs.
FAWR: ALL 5200lbs
RAWR: 2500 6000lbs
3500 SRW 6200lbs
3500 DRW 9350lbs

Engine: 03-04 had 3 options
Cali SO 235/460 (Auto or 5 speed)
SO 250/460 (Auto or 5 speed)
HO 305/555 (Auto or 6 speed)
04.5
HO 325/600
05-07
HO 325/610
07.5-curr
HO MTX 350/610
HO ATX 350/650

Exhaust:
03-04 were 3.5" DP, 4" MBE
04.5-curr full 4"
03-04 only Cali had Cat
04.5-07 all have Cat
07.5-curr use Cat and DPF

Emissions:
03-04 used the cam profile (in-cylinder style EGR, keeps some exhaust in the cylinder)
04.5-07 used the same cam, plus a 3rd injection event, a different piston design, and a Cat to meet emissions.
07.5+ uses an external EGR, DPF, Cat, 4 injection events, and lots of fuel to meet emissions.

[JOHNFAK]

We have a winner !!

Forgot about the brakes - I still have rear drums

Interesting on the engine options also - with SO/HO and CALI variation.


thanks guys

interesting

[dorkweed]

Some of this will be a repeat.

Axles: AAM (9.25" FR, 10.5" Rear (03-04 some SO's), 11.5" all HO's, and all 04.5+) 3.73, 4.10, 3.42 08+

Man Trans: NV4500 03-04, NV5600 03-05; G56 AD 05.5+, G56 AE 07.5+ (RARE in late 07's)

Auto: Early SO's may have 47RE; rest run 48RE (OEM Exhaust Brake capable in 06); 68RFE 07.5+

Xfer Case: NV271 Manual Shift, NV273 Elec Shift

Turbos: HE341 03-04; HE351CW 04.5-07; HE351VE (VNT) 07.5-curr

Head: 03-04 increased flow from 2nd gen; 04.5-05 better flow and better valve seats; 06+ changes to casting for swirl action of air, and IIRC minor valve seat changes.

Injection; CP3 HPCR, up to 23,207 psi for 5.9, and 26,107 psi for 6.7.

Lift Pump: Engine mounted crap till 05, then a quite reliable in-tank that still being used.

Cab's: Quad Cab is streached to be a 3/4 Crew; Mega Cab is introdued in 06 (QCLB frame with a short box)

Frame: Hydroformed (not sure if 2nd gen were)

Brakes: 4 Wheel discs, large enough 17's must be used.

Suspension: From what I can tell all CTD's have the same front spring rates, and they all have the same FAWR; Rear 2500 and 3500 SRW use the same base 4/1 leaf pack rated at 2600 lbs per pack. 3500 DRW has a 3/1 leaf setup rated at 2800 lbs per pack. Both SRW and DRW 3500's have a 2pack overload setup rated at 1400 lbs.
FAWR: ALL 5200lbs
RAWR: 2500 6000lbs
3500 SRW 6200lbs
3500 DRW 9350lbs

Engine: 03-04 had 3 options
Cali SO 235/460 (Auto or 5 speed)
SO 250/460 (Auto or 5 speed)
HO 305/555 (Auto or 6 speed)
04.5
HO 325/600
05-07
HO 325/610
07.5-curr
HO MTX 350/610
HO ATX 350/650

Exhaust:
03-04 were 3.5" DP, 4" MBE
04.5-curr full 4"
03-04 only Cali had Cat
04.5-07 all have Cat
07.5-curr use Cat and DPF

Emissions:
03-04 used the cam profile (in-cylinder style EGR, keeps some exhaust in the cylinder)
04.5-07 used the same cam, plus a 3rd injection event, a different piston design, and a Cat to meet emissions.
07.5+ uses an external EGR, DPF, Cat, 4 injection events, and lots of fuel to meet emissions.

AH64ID beat me to most of it..............heck, almost all of it!!!!!!! I had a '99 regular cab, long bed before my current truck. As much as I loved that '99, my 04.5 is twice the truck and is way more "refined" IMHO. Sorry 2nd gen guys!!!! Quieter, better ride, way more power, just to name a few things.



All that said, these 3rd gens go thru front end parts faster than the 2nd gens. I don't know if it's the Dana vs. AAM thing or not...............or just that the parts are made crappier now!!!!!??? Believe it or not, my 04.5 actually gets.......on average.......better mileage than my '99 did. My old '99 is now my folks truck, but I always make a point to drive it when I go down there.